Sept. 15, 2022

94: Effective Message Management with Tamrin Olden of Law Enforcement Social

94: Effective Message Management with Tamrin Olden of Law Enforcement Social
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Community Education Special Guest

The boys of 3CT talk with public relations and marketing expert, Tamrin Olden of TOC  Public Relations and Law Enforcement Social , about the importance of controlling an impactful public safety narrative through effective communication with the public and the media. 

Tamrin also discusses her experience as a Public Information Officer for a California Police agency and guides us through some of the critical steps of crisis communications, often mishandled by law enforcement agencies. She also explains how a polished and proactive approach to sharing information can not only better improve trust and empathy toward the police, but how it can also save millions of dollars in property and most importantly, lives.    

https://tocpublicrelations.com/

Tamrin Olden has 19 years of experience in government public relations, with 12 years working at a police department as a Community Relations Manager, where she managed media relations, social media, and community outreach programs for the department. For the last six years, she has done independent teaching, consulting, media relations, and digital marketing for her companies TOC Public Relations and Law Enforcement Social. She works with numerous law enforcement agencies, police associations, non-profits, and businesses to help them with their communications, marketing, and branding strategies. 


Transcript
[shaun]:

hello folks welcome back to another episode of three cops talk this is shawn i am here with the trifecta today at uncle chris the

[chris_sherwin]:

hey

[shaun]:

polish

[chris_sherwin]:

what's up

[shaun]:

fog

[chris_sherwin]:

guys

[shaun]:

is joining us you got back from

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

driving his daughter off in

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

beautiful tennessee right was it tennessee without

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

disclosing

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

too much a

[scott]:

hm

[shaun]:

lot of people

[chris_sherwin]:

you're

[shaun]:

going

[chris_sherwin]:

good

[shaun]:

to tennessee

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

and the thrifty norwegian

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

scott big cart scott is

[scott]:

hello

[shaun]:

with us as well no

[scott]:

yep

[chris_sherwin]:

sergeant penny

[shaun]:

major

[chris_sherwin]:

pitcher

[shaun]:

events

[chris_sherwin]:

what's up

[shaun]:

going on

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

uh

[shaun]:

it's good i think this is the first

[scott]:

yah

[shaun]:

time in a long time that all

[chris_sherwin]:

h

[shaun]:

three of us have actually been game fully employed

[scott]:

yah

[shaun]:

in the profession

[chris_sherwin]:

oh yeah

[shaun]:

happy

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

about it and actually

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

happy

[chris_sherwin]:

good

[shaun]:

about

[chris_sherwin]:

job bro

[shaun]:

um

[scott]:

right

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

good job

[shaun]:

big week for me you know it kind of goes well with our show day because we're talking about some things that this organization that

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

i just got picked up by luckily you got picked up by um does a good job with it as far as i'm concern based upon what i saw things that

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

are concerned about that but

[chris_sherwin]:

i think i think the best thing was yesterday two days ago when you were

[shaun]:

the

[chris_sherwin]:

on

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

best

[chris_sherwin]:

there

[shaun]:

thing

[chris_sherwin]:

under

[shaun]:

was

[chris_sherwin]:

social

[shaun]:

two days

[chris_sherwin]:

media

[shaun]:

ago

[chris_sherwin]:

just

[shaun]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

filling

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

it up bro

[shaun]:

you know

[chris_sherwin]:

it

[shaun]:

me

[chris_sherwin]:

was awesome

[shaun]:

you know it's like you know what i

[scott]:

very

[shaun]:

think it was

[scott]:

sharp

[shaun]:

like it's

[scott]:

very

[shaun]:

like

[scott]:

polished

[shaun]:

i was born

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[scott]:

very polished

[shaun]:

wild like i'm old but

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

i was born way like i should have been

[scott]:

yes

[shaun]:

born waiter er than the sixties because like

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

everything i wear

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

like makes me look high waisted it's just like i am

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

high waisted

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

and i'm literally like how do i reach my gun when

[chris_sherwin]:

but

[shaun]:

my

[chris_sherwin]:

dude

[shaun]:

waist

[chris_sherwin]:

you're

[shaun]:

is

[chris_sherwin]:

the

[shaun]:

at

[chris_sherwin]:

only

[shaun]:

my

[chris_sherwin]:

one

[shaun]:

nipple

[chris_sherwin]:

i know that

[shaun]:

line

[chris_sherwin]:

could do three creases

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

in a shirt and three creases and a pant and pull it off like

[shaun]:

actually

[chris_sherwin]:

a straight

[shaun]:

there

[chris_sherwin]:

line

[shaun]:

was i'm gonna explain to you

[scott]:

very

[shaun]:

there's

[scott]:

sharp

[shaun]:

there is a sweat shop in venom that did that

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

for me i had nothing to do with that

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

because i checked the labels on all the things that i wear and like vina

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

so cool like we've been able

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

to actually

[scott]:

ah

[shaun]:

enter into trade agrees with these

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

folks you know when there's still people that may have some issue with that but the bottom line is this global economy so it's it's all good but

[scott]:

right

[shaun]:

it was great it was great

[scott]:

and you

[shaun]:

to

[scott]:

need

[shaun]:

be

[scott]:

your

[shaun]:

part

[scott]:

pants

[shaun]:

of that right

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

it's like and they made my pants uh

[chris_sherwin]:

yah

[shaun]:

the uh

[chris_sherwin]:

h

[shaun]:

yeah it's

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

and that was one of the things that you know i was like wow how appropriate

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

is that my wife even pointing out to carry said you know there

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

is an organization that does sharing in asian right like she's like

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

we've been down here for a while and you know

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

charleston is a great kept secret from tourism

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

things like that but in the same sense they do a really good job of keeping

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

people informed about things that are going on that are concerning i like you see squad cars

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

raced

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

in an area people was like oh i wonder what's going on and it's

[scott]:

hm

[shaun]:

funny at times my know my wife knows more about it or quicker than most other people she's like

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

oh yeah this what's

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

going on and that was going on and it's really

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

of cool that's a testament

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

to it and during

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

that day like you know how like where

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

we work guys and three of us and maybe where we currently

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

you know where we

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

spent some other time

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[scott]:

a

[shaun]:

it's just like

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

nobody cared about anything

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

that we did or putting it out or get in front

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

of it like

[scott]:

yah

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

you know the fact that things are

[scott]:

ah

[shaun]:

shared about you

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

as an individual as well as the organization

[scott]:

we

[shaun]:

really

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

is thing the folks that came into the room to kind of cover it were like

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

they were like three deep there's photographers video people sound people was like

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

wow

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

this is like how things should be done because this is what

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[shaun]:

we

[scott]:

what

[shaun]:

lack with a lot of

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

pep in the world particularly this younger generation of folks that are used to the kind of the glits and the gleam

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

and the social media aspect

[scott]:

ah

[shaun]:

and stuff getting out there

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

rather quickly it does challenge guys like me that are used to kind of just saying

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

whatever they think at times you know what

[scott]:

hm

[shaun]:

i mean

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

you do have to be

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

very guarded like

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

chief are you cool with me dropping an f bomb here like

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

like

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

during my

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

you know like my swearing and speech

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

it's kind like don't

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[scott]:

no

[shaun]:

don't do

[scott]:

don't

[shaun]:

that

[scott]:

do

[shaun]:

and

[scott]:

that

[shaun]:

that's not

[scott]:

no

[shaun]:

a

[chris_sherwin]:

we

[shaun]:

good

[chris_sherwin]:

get

[shaun]:

idea

[chris_sherwin]:

our

[scott]:

that's

[chris_sherwin]:

news from reading the paper still i mean now you

[scott]:

it's

[chris_sherwin]:

got

[shaun]:

right

[chris_sherwin]:

to

[scott]:

not

[chris_sherwin]:

be

[shaun]:

exactly

[chris_sherwin]:

on

[scott]:

prohibited

[chris_sherwin]:

top of it

[scott]:

it's discouraged

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

right

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

right i'm still out in the front yard looking for

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

the paper in the

[chris_sherwin]:

where's

[shaun]:

plastic

[chris_sherwin]:

my

[shaun]:

bag

[chris_sherwin]:

morning paper

[shaun]:

atlanta

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

right on the dog trap that kid's doing this on purpose

[scott]:

and you're laying

[shaun]:

anyway

[scott]:

it out on the patio because it got wet so you're

[shaun]:

right

[scott]:

trying

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

drying

[scott]:

to dry

[shaun]:

it out

[scott]:

it out

[shaun]:

right

[scott]:

so you can

[shaun]:

right

[scott]:

read it later

[shaun]:

right right and i'm still

[scott]:

yeh

[shaun]:

snipping pons for like i said

[scott]:

right

[shaun]:

the seers

[scott]:

right

[shaun]:

like you know

[chris_sherwin]:

oh i'm

[shaun]:

since

[chris_sherwin]:

polish

[scott]:

jac penny

[chris_sherwin]:

i snipped

[scott]:

adds

[shaun]:

yes

[chris_sherwin]:

cupinesoyou

[shaun]:

just done

[chris_sherwin]:

kid

[shaun]:

so well

[chris_sherwin]:

me

[shaun]:

but

[chris_sherwin]:

she's two for one

[shaun]:

chris

[chris_sherwin]:

two

[shaun]:

i

[chris_sherwin]:

for

[shaun]:

wasn't

[chris_sherwin]:

one

[shaun]:

alone in this though you were out there being celebrated by your team too man that was really good stuff like it

[chris_sherwin]:

oh yeah yeah

[shaun]:

you

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

know the old slow south

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

is b s i don't agree with that i

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[scott]:

i

[shaun]:

think that the south is doing

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

a way better job from where we came from this and information with people scooter you're deep in the middle of all that

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

are they etting better or not m

[scott]:

we're definitely getting

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[scott]:

better here with that i feel like we get a lot more information out now and

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[scott]:

you know one of the things like talking about and i know we're on to talk about it more but about how quickly stuff gets out i mean there's there's facebook pages and twitter accounts and stuff here where people are regularly

[chris_sherwin]:

my

[scott]:

listening to things scanners on the radio and the

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[scott]:

they're putting stuff out so you're

[shaun]:

hm

[scott]:

you're competing against

[shaun]:

oh

[scott]:

private

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[scott]:

people who are just and they're not doing it one way or the other like with an opinion on it they're just getting it out there but you gotta you got to know that we should be getting stuff out as fast as these people are getting things out as well you know

[shaun]:

so

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

basically they got rid of that mimeograph machine because they cut that guy huff

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

and all those chemicals they

[chris_sherwin]:

is right

[shaun]:

use

[scott]:

right

[chris_sherwin]:

uh

[shaun]:

what's up with you get out of here dude it's going

[scott]:

get out of

[shaun]:

down

[scott]:

here

[shaun]:

man change the ease their backwards on the press

[chris_sherwin]:

uh yeah

[shaun]:

anyway but our guest today

[chris_sherwin]:

m m

[shaun]:

is a really really progressive

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

and obviously really patient human being because she's

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

actually still here i can

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

see her

[chris_sherwin]:

she hasn't

[shaun]:

in the

[chris_sherwin]:

hung

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

video

[chris_sherwin]:

up yet so this

[shaun]:

actually

[chris_sherwin]:

is good

[shaun]:

still here

[chris_sherwin]:

this

[shaun]:

she's

[chris_sherwin]:

is

[shaun]:

not

[chris_sherwin]:

good

[shaun]:

hung up yet the one ting she's joining us from sunny california

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

where it's like it's still yesterday at this point

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

in the day an were

[scott]:

right

[shaun]:

doing that she's a great sport for that but she has seventeen years or

[scott]:

ah

[shaun]:

nineteen

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[shaun]:

actually now nineteen years of experience in public relations for local government and

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

law enforcement agencies

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

including twelve years with

[scott]:

well

[shaun]:

the chino california police department as a community

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

relations manager she eloped and managed all aspects of

[chris_sherwin]:

a

[shaun]:

public relations from marketing

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

and branding to social

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

media and media relations basically a top

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

notch pio or public information officer

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

he also supervised

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

the crime vention unit which will ask her a little bit

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

about that there

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

which is kind of unique

[chris_sherwin]:

m right

[shaun]:

in addition

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

to over the last six years she has

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

worked with dozens of public safety and government organizations businesses non profit groups and the satan's

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

to provide training websites digital marking and

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

communication s consulting through her company's

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

law enforcement social and the cameron old and consulting

[chris_sherwin]:

ye

[shaun]:

company she has a basceor's degree and psychology

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

from cal state university

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

fullerton so folks please

[scott]:

h

[shaun]:

welcome our guest

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

tameron old and tameron thanks for coming today

[scott]:

hi

[chris_sherwin]:

tamen

[shaun]:

we appreciate

[chris_sherwin]:

thank

[shaun]:

it

[chris_sherwin]:

you

[shaun]:

your

[chris_sherwin]:

so

[shaun]:

patients

[chris_sherwin]:

much for getting

[shaun]:

with

[chris_sherwin]:

up

[shaun]:

us

[chris_sherwin]:

early and doing this thank you

[shaun]:

kenn

[tamrin_olden]:

a

[shaun]:

you dig in a little bit

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

more about a young woman like

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

yourself

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

so much younger

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

than me

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

oh

[shaun]:

like is joking earlier i'm old

[chris_sherwin]:

i'll

[shaun]:

enough

[chris_sherwin]:

say

[shaun]:

to be your older brother young lady

[tamrin_olden]:

yeah

[shaun]:

how you got interested in something like that you know i mean it's not necessarily the most glamorous work in the world

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

and you're dealing with in the realm of communication people that are still like afraid of fire

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

you know what i mean

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

like in law enforcement how do you get involved in this

[tamrin_olden]:

so i actually

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

had zero intention of getting into this

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

profession when i was twenty

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

just a couple of years ago

[shaun]:

there you go right

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

i was in college and so job posting

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

for the

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

city and i was like okay i mean decent job flexible schedule

[shaun]:

kay

[tamrin_olden]:

part time well i'm going to college and went for it got the job doing community relations for parkson reck and

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

able to get promotion opportunity another promotion opportunity another promotion opportunity and i

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

said

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

hey the police department has a full time gig

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

something that i'm interested in my minor was criminal

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

justice i'll go check it out and here i am just never left

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and went on to pursue the psycho the psychology aspect

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

of criminal justice which originally intended to do so i just i kind

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

of fell in love with the p r side

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

of it and it was so

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

unique and different and new it was a challenge

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

for me to be able to build it from the ground up

[scott]:

my

[chris_sherwin]:

that's

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

awesome

[shaun]:

i imagine imagine you must have seen like our

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

our ability to know i'm gonna be straight with you like we joke about it a lot but one thing is almost commeebcause our level of inability to communicate

[chris_sherwin]:

my

[shaun]:

a fact tively with the public about really crisis type communication and

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

very little people are do that like when you were on the job and so like yeah i want to be a p o you're like what is that like a like pisa

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

delivery guy

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

what is that

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

what

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

do you

[scott]:

what

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

what

[scott]:

is

[shaun]:

do you

[scott]:

that

[shaun]:

mean you want to do that and you see like

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

people got it reluctantly guys correct me if i'm wrong there you know in the agencies

[chris_sherwin]:

no

[shaun]:

that

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

we worked up people like

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

why would you want to do that but it's actually so important what we do and the outside consulting aspect of that is huge for us to

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

take

[chris_sherwin]:

well

[shaun]:

it from an side

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah for sure well tam correct me if i'm wrong but you got started don't now you must ave ben about three when it's all started but you kind of started

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

when

[shaun]:

hm

[chris_sherwin]:

it was police departments held a lot of information close to their chest and didn't want to get out whether it's good or bad

[shaun]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

to to the public because we all

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

thought oh my god you know we're on to

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

be double o seven james bond we can't let it out you know people are gonna you know ramp and be afraid or whatever so you kind of you were there when we took it from being real really quiet to almost giving out almost everything on a case

[scott]:

yeah like

[chris_sherwin]:

you

[scott]:

regular

[chris_sherwin]:

know to catch

[scott]:

updates

[chris_sherwin]:

people

[scott]:

and stuff

[chris_sherwin]:

yea

[scott]:

here

[chris_sherwin]:

or warn people how did that kind of work out what was that challenge

[tamrin_olden]:

so you're absolutely correct in that

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

we and there's actually

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

a

[tamrin_olden]:

it's shocking that there's a lot of departments out there that still

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

have that old school

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

mentality of don't talk to the media

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

no comment statement and we were one of those agencies back in the day and actually the need for us to have someone dedicated you're totally right that it's not something someone goes into the profession especially on the sworn

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

side wanting to do having insight knowledge experience

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

and interest

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

for us it was the internal affairs lieutenant

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

professional standards and it was oh here you go this goes along with your assignment on there

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

was no interest they weren't pro

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

active

[shaun]:

yes

[tamrin_olden]:

the only time

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

they

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

showed up if they

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

did

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

was when there was an officer involved shooting and they had to say something

[chris_sherwin]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

and we

[scott]:

i

[tamrin_olden]:

actually got a a flag and a lot of negativity from the local

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

media and obviously in southern

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

california the media is very active for being unco operative and that every time they wanted information or statement they weren't getting responses

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

back they

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

were singing information anywhere online

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

like social media there was no news releases the watch commander

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

wouldn't call them back they're getting passed around and so

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

a couple of the networks complained

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

and said hey

[scott]:

really

[tamrin_olden]:

we have a job to do and this can also be a benefit to you you need to be more cooperative

[shaun]:

ah

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and so that's

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

when

[shaun]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

i was voluntold by

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

the

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

so

[chris_sherwin]:

welcome

[tamrin_olden]:

hey

[shaun]:

love

[chris_sherwin]:

to the police

[shaun]:

that

[chris_sherwin]:

world

[tamrin_olden]:

you

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

do other duties as assigned in your job description

[chris_sherwin]:

and

[tamrin_olden]:

and

[chris_sherwin]:

here

[tamrin_olden]:

you do you know community relation stuff you do public

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

speaking so now you're the p o

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

that's literally how it started

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and it

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

was a big undertaking transitioning from don't

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

say anything and then getting people

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

inside

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

to buy in when you're going to the lieutenant are you going to the chief or the captain

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

saying hey i need this information we need to put it out dealing with that resistance which a lot of agencies still deal with that where they don't

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

want to add information and are aware that legally you actually can

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

put out a lot of information

[scott]:

right and to your point

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[scott]:

i mean i think like at least it seems like with this with getting put into that pio job always was just kind of that person

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[scott]:

who they didn't

[shaun]:

yeah

[scott]:

necessarily have any formal training it was just um you're doing this job now or you're you're going into it and you don't have any training but by the way you're going to be responsible for giving doing press conferences and press releases and that kind of thing is it is there's more stuff out there now or that's also kind of like what you do but more stuff out there now to better equip people to be in that pio role

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

there absolutely is and you're right

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

there was hardly any training way back of the day

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

one of the local sheriffs academy i think t was orange county

[chris_sherwin]:

ye

[tamrin_olden]:

sheriffs posted a training so i went in

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

it

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

was hard there wasn't really

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

a lot to it a lot of the concepts weren't

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

very new and modern and it didn't include a lot of the

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

social media stuff and

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

that made it challenging me to do my job effectively so i mean i had to learn and study

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

a lot on my own

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

because it wasn't

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

anything that i went to

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

college for wasn't

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

anything i had real experience

[scott]:

m oh

[tamrin_olden]:

with and the more i learned

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

the liability of the position in that you know we invest so much time energy training

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

budget resource as staff into all these specialized teams

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and units

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and you be lucky if you're a p o and you even have a line item in the budget dedicated to training

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

equipment and

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

resources and then realizing i mean

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

you say one

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

thing or an incident goes down

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and there's

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

usually in big cases civil litigation

[shaun]:

m

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

following that

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

i mean you can cost the

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

department its reputation

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and millions of

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

dollars

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

i mean people

[shaun]:

well

[tamrin_olden]:

don't really

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

understand and i deal with it as a consultant dealing with critical incidents my communications

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

with my clients

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

i have to release those during civil cases and people don't understand how how serious it is and how you you can't just throw someone

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

in and go oh you're

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

you're the po on top of your other job and not giving the proper training because you're setting

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

them up to fail

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

and

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

ve seen that so

[shaun]:

yes

[tamrin_olden]:

many times

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

during

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

huge major

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

national critical incidents that communications failures and breakdowns

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

are one of the worst aspects of the de briefs of those types of incidents

[scott]:

hm

[shaun]:

you one of the things i think

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

you know this is just my impression

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

of it is like i think somebody has to be a p

[scott]:

ah

[shaun]:

has to not be from our

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

world or not from our our family so to speak in an agency

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

like law enforcement retains people for you know some it's decades

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

and you know you're

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

you're in bread in that you know for that kind of sound negative but like you got almost got to be like the wolf from pulp

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

fiction or are from enteragewher you have to be that

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

blunt i communicate because

[scott]:

right

[shaun]:

one when you're dealing with

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

cops everything has to be a smack in the face for you to figure

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[shaun]:

it out like everybody has a plan til

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

they get punched in the face that's the police world

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

like literally

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

like well like well this is the way we've always now why would that be why these people don't need to know

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[shaun]:

what's going on

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

and like everybody gets in line

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

i'm gon

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

about to piss off the chief where somebody has to be almost untouchable in that sense to say

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

look at me i'm sorry i have to be hurt but have to fix this

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

problem for you like obviously it's much

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

more graphic and pulp fiction and

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

are as much more of a blunt

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

individual than that but the bottom

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

line is like for our listeners to kind of relate to

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

some things out there generationally by the way that two generations tried to get in there you have to kind

[scott]:

nice

[shaun]:

of be blunt nd not afraid to

[scott]:

right

[shaun]:

confront the guy and say hey look

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

or go for that manure hey look here's a deal i know what all of these people are telling you

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

but the truth matters because

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

ordinary officer

[chris_sherwin]:

i

[shaun]:

i used to get frustrated like that's

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

not the true story we're not telling the truth here we need like the truth is the whole truth and nothing

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[shaun]:

about the truth if i have to stand on the stand

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

raise my right hand to say that

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

why is it that we have to get of people i understand we

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

have to protect people's rights

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

and things like that but

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

how does that

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

challenge like

[scott]:

ah

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

i think it's got to be some of the most challenging crisis communication management

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

has got to be some of the toughest to do

[scott]:

my

[shaun]:

with the police world because like if the information is bad

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

cities burned or it's not got out in a proper manner is that can you take us through that a little bit how do you manage that process between the truth and what the truth needs to be at the right time

[tamrin_olden]:

right and you know you

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

brought up something so

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

relevant in that

[scott]:

yes

[tamrin_olden]:

it

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

is crisis communications and being able

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

to push back

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and i would say you

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

have to pick the right person

[shaun]:

yeah

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and someone who has

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

the ability

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

ye

[tamrin_olden]:

and the competence and confidenc

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

to supervise up and what i mean by that is we would have incidents

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and they would go okay let's get all the command stuff

[scott]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

together and get all their opinions and i would sit there and say okay

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

i wouldn't come in as a civilian

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

until you how to run your squad operation or the tactical side of it because that's

[shaun]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

not what i do so

[shaun]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

people who have zero training experience our insight into the world of communications should not be steering and making decisions or having

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

that big of a sa when it comes to communications

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

i would pick the right people train them support them and get the hell out of the way because

[shaun]:

hm

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

you need to allow them

[shaun]:

what

[tamrin_olden]:

to propel your organization

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

forward quickly we can't wait to sit there in brief and d brief and get everybody up and down the chain of commands opinion because now you already have the story out there specially now with social

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

and phones you can't wait that long and there were times where we were getting destroyed by the media and they're outside our door waiting for a statement and we're sitting here fiddling i'm with

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

everyone

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

wanting to red pen a statement

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

and i had to say chief let's go in your office

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

i got a lot of side i had

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

and i said what

[scott]:

right

[shaun]:

yah

[tamrin_olden]:

you want to stay i'm not dis respecting their

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

rank but

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

at the end of the day this is you

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

and your reputation

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

our organization that's

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

at

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

risk and what you want to say

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and my

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

support and guidance and helping you out a little that's all that matters right now

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

and we could work this out later but we can't keep waiting and

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

you have to have someone who's willing to push back and who's willing to say no i'm sorry i don't agree with that this

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

is what we need to do and that's what my position now as a consultant

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

allows me to do is like you said someone from the outside

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

knows the industry who knows what he

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

does home work on what the media is like in

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

that area who knows and researches your community

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

who's involved in the facebook groups within your

[scott]:

my

[tamrin_olden]:

organizations jurisdiction

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

so that way i know

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

how to taylor that message specifically for your community and for your department and

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

having an outside perspective allows me to do that because we get blind son were so

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

guilty of that and missing things

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

because

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

we're so narrowly focused a lot of times on the operational side

[chris_sherwin]:

and i also think that you know it's hard when you're like you don't know what the you you want to get the truth out you

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

don't want you don't want to say too much you don't want to say

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

too little and i don't think i mean from the police we're operational so most of us go like okay we're on to go through that door we're going to go do this or do that and we fail

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

when it comes to you know communication to outside people that don't understand who's in the incident

[scott]:

yeah right

[chris_sherwin]:

you know and i just think that you know

[shaun]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

having somebody alter to do that is more important because what i'm gather and

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

you guys all know i'm in a high school now when i'm gathering from a

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

lot of

[shaun]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

kids that are in school when we talk is that they

[tamrin_olden]:

ye

[chris_sherwin]:

don't really care about the news they don't see

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

n n fower they don't they

[scott]:

ah

[chris_sherwin]:

get all of their

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

new

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

right from right from the horse's mouth because and i

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

personally

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

was taught something different cause i thought our know our younger generation was like

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

they didn't care

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

but i found that not to be

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

true they do

[shaun]:

ah

[chris_sherwin]:

care but they don't want to go to

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

ah

[chris_sherwin]:

a source that gets filtered three times they want to go

[shaun]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

to a source like they'll go to you know

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

the county you know

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

the county website of the police department website as soon as something

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

comes out or they hear something they

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

don't go they're not going through the traditional news

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

media any more

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

and i think this is so important because then it gets the truth out and it gets the ball rolling in the right direction

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

for all parties involved not just the police but what's going on in our incident and i found that very very

[shaun]:

ah

[chris_sherwin]:

interesting that you know instagram and all this other stuff you hear all this negative stuff but actually the people i've been talking to this is where they go but they want to see somebody like cameron

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

come on to camer and say hey this is what's going on i represent so and so or chief coming on

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

ah

[chris_sherwin]:

going this is what's going on

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

this is you know what's on this and just getting it direct from because

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

we all saw it with with valde and there's no more

[shaun]:

ah

[chris_sherwin]:

to talk about that but the bottom line and that was all

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

messed up up in including

[scott]:

ah

[chris_sherwin]:

how the media and how the news was translated by by the colonel or whoever that was and i just think people are going more

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

and more direct to the source because

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

of all the you know

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

whatever you want to call it political you know a genders

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

or whatever there much more want to go

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

to the source and personally i think in camera this

[scott]:

my

[chris_sherwin]:

might be a business idea if it doesn't exist i think if there was a network that all

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

departments could funnel their

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

news to one network of what's going on of critical incidents but real time like you know cameron has two or three people that work for this twenty four hours a day sometimes you're just sitting there sometimes there's

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

rolling what's going

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

on if you go to that one source and all they do they're putting out

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

the content of what is going on right now in different aspects of the united states or

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

your region i think that would be huge because i think people are going more to that source because they believe it or and it's coming from direct from there it's not being filtered

[tamrin_olden]:

yeah absolutely

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

and i say all the time if you don't tell

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

your story

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

someone's

[scott]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

going to tell it for you

[shaun]:

right

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

so you have the platforms and the opportunity and

[scott]:

okay

[tamrin_olden]:

it kind of

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

removes goes along with what you're saying

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

the need for traditional

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

news you don't need it you could get a mite

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

you

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

could get a camera and you could live stream and do your own statement

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

you don't need the news to

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

do that for you because like you said people will come

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

to you if you consistently show up

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and give them the information that they need

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

and

[chris_sherwin]:

and

[tamrin_olden]:

say

[chris_sherwin]:

we don't

[tamrin_olden]:

what

[chris_sherwin]:

have to worry about what self

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

exactly say what you can when you can and i

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

get there's

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

confidentiality issues

[chris_sherwin]:

uh

[tamrin_olden]:

there

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

is not not wanting

[chris_sherwin]:

h

[tamrin_olden]:

to compromise an investigation absolutely respect that but outside of

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

that you need

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

to give people information

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

so that way

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

they know what to do how it affects them and they can move on

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

they're just wanting to know

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

you know what the facts are so we

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

have to our hands are forced

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

at this point that if they're

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

going a look somewhere so you would want them to come

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

to

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

versus to a source where there is going to be miss information

[chris_sherwin]:

but

[scott]:

and

[chris_sherwin]:

even

[scott]:

do

[chris_sherwin]:

the

[scott]:

you

[chris_sherwin]:

confidentiality

[scott]:

do you find that

[chris_sherwin]:

portion of harry scott one more thing even the confidential portion when it comes from

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

a new source they always make

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

the left hand turn a right hand turn saying that they're hiding stuff

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

or whatever where if it's coming direct from

[shaun]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

the source hey this is confidential due to the fact of whatever sorry scott

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

head

[scott]:

no okay i was going to ask i mean how much do you think nowadays with stuff that pos are getting out how much of it is it a fifty fifty is it getting

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[scott]:

out the facts of whatever the inside is as well as um dispelling myths and rumors about what actually happened like i mean you're doing you're having to do a lot of both right

[tamrin_olden]:

yes and i think that unfortunately

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

a lot of agencies are still very much

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

they put out their statements

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

they read very similar to

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

a police

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

report or a synopsis or we call them sirs ificatincident report where

[scott]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

you're giving you know basically

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

your boss and the watch commander

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

you know

[scott]:

write a rundown of what happened

[tamrin_olden]:

this happened these were the serfs this was the dispo and they're not thinking okay

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

what does the public need to know how is it affect them and

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

what is the public interest

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

side of it

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

and now you have to do the side of doing your home work and

[scott]:

a

[tamrin_olden]:

saying okay what's being set out there already

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

what do we need to correct so that we

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

can get correct that misinformation

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

because there's a lot of people

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

who are literally streaming and tweeting and people listening to scanners put down an information that doesn't have context and

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

if you don't do your

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

social listening and seeing what's being said online and include that into your messaging

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

you're going to be missing the mark because sometimes we think oh they want to know this

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

when reality that's not what they want to know and that's not what they're focused on or that's not the story that's being put out there that you need to correct so doing your homework timely is also really big big part of it i mean one of the cases that i'm working here in

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

southern california it's

[scott]:

yeah yes

[tamrin_olden]:

very big and when we prepared our statement a lot of it was in response to misinformation that

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

was put out by the

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

oh individuals family that was involved

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

uh

[tamrin_olden]:

attorney

[chris_sherwin]:

uh

[tamrin_olden]:

a

[shaun]:

right

[scott]:

okay

[tamrin_olden]:

so pretty much our whole thing was countering every

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

that was said

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

versus this is what happened actually

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

it was

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

no this is what you guys are hearing and here's

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

facts

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

supporting that that's that's

[shaun]:

oh

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

not the case

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

so completely change the narrative and you have to be able to like you said balance both it really truly is a balance of getting the facts

[shaun]:

m

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

out and then

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

correcting misinformation that's out there

[shaun]:

oh

[scott]:

and do you think there's like do you i notice i feel like more now with more critical incidents than we had

[shaun]:

m

[scott]:

one here in illinois last month that the our state police here was getting out

[tamrin_olden]:

a

[scott]:

pretty regular statements is there like a set time frame of how

[shaun]:

ah

[scott]:

often you should be like for a major critical

[shaun]:

oh

[scott]:

incident is there a sad amount of time that you should say hey we're doing brief

[shaun]:

mah

[scott]:

ings at this time this time this time

[shaun]:

oh

[scott]:

you know a certain amount of time too much is a certain amount of time not enough like what's your what's your take on that

[tamrin_olden]:

so i think

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

that as far as giving

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

minor

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

updates like let's say there's a perimeter

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

set up

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

or

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

the area that's impacted

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

is expanding

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

that you can give regular updates live they come up as far as a full

[scott]:

hm

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

up dated kind of press briefing if

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

seeing is evolving and you

[scott]:

no

[tamrin_olden]:

have relevant big chumps of information available there are some

[chris_sherwin]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

people who do ourly

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

updates but

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

if you

[shaun]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

don't have because

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

they

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

have something significant enough whether

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

it's up date on numbers or data or

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

suspecting custody or victims

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

agencies that are involved in aspects of the

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

the investigation that you need to get out to the public

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

then yes absolutely do continuous

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

updates but if not i would

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

say probably an initial

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

a wrap

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

up once everything is kind of led in or settled down

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

then once everything

[shaun]:

ah

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

is kind of completed

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

do another one so kind of at the beginning middle

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and end stage unless you have

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

anything

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

you know evolving there somewhere you're

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[scott]:

significant

[tamrin_olden]:

having

[scott]:

changes her

[tamrin_olden]:

absolutely

[scott]:

right

[shaun]:

it seems like in this day and age we've talked about this on previous shows one having to do with elections with chris harvey and

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

that the actors at the

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

top of the

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

say the icon so to speak of what we're following whether it be a presidential candidate a mayor or election official whatever they're the ones that are helping to spread this whole idea like well they're hiding this from us for a reason and things like that and you're managing almost like again the perfect storm like information travels so much quicker than it

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

does right now vacuums are a board in natur and usually they're filled with negativity and the longer you

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

go as the official person and sharing that information

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

or at least the representation

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

of why people are watching it

[chris_sherwin]:

my

[shaun]:

it's really rough and do pro this

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

is a part of this we have to make sure that we're not ginning people up to say this is where we think this has happened and why it's happened and you know cities have burned since you know our nation's

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

founding over and feathering of people all the way to

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

cities burning during riots to now we're rounding people up and remember after nine eleven

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

a lot of people in the seat community were being targeted because people were misinformed

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

about like

[scott]:

hm

[shaun]:

yes they're not even

[scott]:

your

[shaun]:

you know that's not even

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

the people that supposedly were behind some of this

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

and it's really tough to do and the responsibility in that process of doing that

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

it's only appropriate to you come from california where

[scott]:

no

[shaun]:

the labreatarp it's are you're literally looking at the police

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

and the media the traditional media stuck in that tar pit dying like not like and everyone's around it looking

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

at it in well we're not going to commit it to help you because you were i'm gonna have to walk into it kind of a thing

[scott]:

hm

[shaun]:

and it's like when are we going to get wise to

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

that so if you could walk our listeners through like i was on swat for seventeen years and i'm not bragging about it but in the same sense it's like we were called up for certain things like

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

how are you as a pio activated is it well after the fact is it do you think it's from your experience like he there's a critical incident going on we call the team the next person calls the p i mean like walk us through that process how ideally it should work and then maybe how it's actually going

[tamrin_olden]:

so in an ideal situation if

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

anything

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

even at the point of hey

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

i think

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

there's

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

public interest here it's going to be controversial it could possibly go south like

[scott]:

no

[tamrin_olden]:

any anticipation it's kind of like you put people on standby you get mutually set up because

[shaun]:

right

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

you don't know what's going to happen we used to have and we set a system in place that we would do an incident notification and it was to the supervisors

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

um city hall and

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

to me where we would

[chris_sherwin]:

yah

[tamrin_olden]:

put out an incident despatch or whoever would say

[chris_sherwin]:

h

[tamrin_olden]:

hey

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

f why we're working

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

this

[scott]:

a

[tamrin_olden]:

will be putting out up date so kind of

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

you're staging right and you're saying okay i'm goin to keep monitoring and then

[scott]:

ye

[tamrin_olden]:

that's when i could go okay i need to

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

go online are people talking about it is there missing from should i need to address if something does go down do i have the facts of the circumstances that led us up to that point to that way

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

you would usually literally draft something jesting as you know even if nine times

[scott]:

ye

[tamrin_olden]:

out of ten you don't have to use the statement it's

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

building that no kind of that process of practicing right like sweat you train train

[scott]:

oh yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

you hope that you don't have to every single time when you get deployed that things

[scott]:

ah

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

don't go

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

the way that

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

you practice them completely on the taptegoal side of it but

[shaun]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

you're ready every single time

[shaun]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

well the trigger if you have to and that's the same

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

concept

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

of i'm ready i have a statement ready i know

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

pos for anybody who's assisting whether

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

it's fire whether it's no ch whether it's the county and i know exactly

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

if things go bad i have everything lined up that i could send and i could put it out there and let everybody know immediately at least an initial so if

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

the bad thing is you know obviously unless you

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

have a p o team where you rotate coverage our shifts you know i wasn't there i worked monday through thursday i worked four tenths so after hours

[shaun]:

hm

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

nights and weekends the challenge was supervisors

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

on patrol and the detective supervisors

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

keeping

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

me informed if you're doing a squat operation

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

or you're doing a

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

search warrant

[scott]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

and there's even any inclination

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

that you think that it could go bad you need to be making notifications because the more you can

[shaun]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

prepare

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

in advance the smoother

[shaun]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

things are going to go when

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

it does hit the fan and

[shaun]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

i

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

think that practicing is is part of it just like we train for every situation

[scott]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

and law enforcement on the tactical

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

side is the same exact thing so

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

unfortunately that's also the

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

worst thing is the flow of communication i mean there were times

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

because i had actually lived in the city for a while i drive by somewhere and i'm like what the hell is going

[shaun]:

i wonder

[tamrin_olden]:

on

[shaun]:

what's

[tamrin_olden]:

over there

[shaun]:

going on over

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[scott]:

what's

[shaun]:

there

[scott]:

happening

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[scott]:

there

[shaun]:

right right

[tamrin_olden]:

you got time

[shaun]:

right

[chris_sherwin]:

nobody

[tamrin_olden]:

scene

[chris_sherwin]:

told

[tamrin_olden]:

taper's

[chris_sherwin]:

me

[shaun]:

yeah right

[scott]:

all

[tamrin_olden]:

today

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

i'm checking

[chris_sherwin]:

nobody

[tamrin_olden]:

my phone

[chris_sherwin]:

told

[tamrin_olden]:

in like

[chris_sherwin]:

me yeah

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

all right you

[shaun]:

yeah

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

people knew that

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

i worked there

[scott]:

yes

[tamrin_olden]:

and lived in the city so they go hey what's going on over there and i'm

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

like i

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

don't know you probably know more than

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

i go on to our local kay and i go

[scott]:

h

[tamrin_olden]:

oh

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

apparently there's an incident going down and i have

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

no clue and

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

working through that and getting

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

people because you don't think you respond to the threat you're thinking about the tactical operational side of it and as supervisor is

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

taking that extra step to go crap even if it's hey dispatch can

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

you put out a notification to the p o

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

don't have to physically be the one doing it but at least getting them ready to go needs to be you now part of your critical instant response in our

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

critical incident response manuals we put the communications portion in there if something happens you know that that needs to be part of the process

[scott]:

hm

[chris_sherwin]:

now when you do that are you

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

you always kind of is it like a chess game were

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

always gotta kind of be two two or three steps ahead whether

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

it's a critical incident whether the officer

[scott]:

just

[chris_sherwin]:

is

[scott]:

a large

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[scott]:

police

[chris_sherwin]:

or the

[scott]:

presence or something

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[scott]:

like that

[chris_sherwin]:

large place presence or an

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

officer does something what could be perceived is wrong or incorrect or

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

um you know it's a large incident

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

and you know just if present an evrything going on do you find yourself that you have to be

[shaun]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

two three steps ahead to prevent stuff or support stuff

[tamrin_olden]:

oh absolutely and i think that you know again as you become more ingrained into the role in the

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

position of knowing

[scott]:

my

[tamrin_olden]:

what departments are involved with the tone that you're chief or

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

sheriff wants to have because you know they might have their preference

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

on how things are said or what is said knowing

[shaun]:

yes

[tamrin_olden]:

sensitivities in your community

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

because one message

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

might go over well in one commun

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and two counties over

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

no

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

you're having a male because

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

they don't you know there's certain

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

sensitivities because of you know

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

history in the department or the community or whatever

[shaun]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

it is

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

and

[shaun]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

you have to be prepared

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

you have to be two

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

steps ahead and

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

being able to anticipate and i would send it

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

on briefing i would go to every command staff meeting because i'd be sitting there going did you say you guys not have an operation

[shaun]:

yah

[tamrin_olden]:

friday and you're having

[shaun]:

h

[tamrin_olden]:

mutual aid come in okay i take note of that so

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

that way i remember

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and put on my calendar

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

okay i need to make sure that i'm following up and being ready just

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

in case something happens

[chris_sherwin]:

do you guys find

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

more and more based on the police

[scott]:

ye

[chris_sherwin]:

civilian relationship right now do you

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

find it

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

more people like they're just not believing it and coming after you like you know the coption this acoption and do that

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

or this is that do you always get into or do you ever get into well he or she did this because or do you just let it lie and just let it kind of filter away or do you address it i mean the officer shot because the person had of coming at him and got cut or whatever do find yourself more and more because i would

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

assume based on what i see that no matter what you put out at this stage of where we are with the relationship between police and civilians is that it's negative

[scott]:

ye

[chris_sherwin]:

right negative towards the policeman in a lot of instances and do you find yourself having to put out more information to battle that or you just let it lie

[tamrin_olden]:

absolutely you are completely tailoring your message to they're probably going to assume this or they're going to categorize

[scott]:

right

[chris_sherwin]:

okay

[tamrin_olden]:

this incident

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

like one that happened three years ago ten states over

[shaun]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

and

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

now that they're going to question this

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

they're going to question

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

that these are the officers actions they're going to question these are the circumstances of the suspect

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

that they're going to question and taylor

[chris_sherwin]:

my

[tamrin_olden]:

your message

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

completely to that and it's anticipating

[chris_sherwin]:

okay

[tamrin_olden]:

what are they going to focus on um and identify okay what were the circumstances leading up to the incident happening to be able to

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

justify that you know the officers actions and then the other

[chris_sherwin]:

okay

[tamrin_olden]:

side of it

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

is okay were they armed or not we need to show a photo physically of

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

a guy

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

i mean

[scott]:

yep

[tamrin_olden]:

and that

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

needs to be the poco point of it

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

how did we get there and that there was a viable threat the other part of it is releasing the body orn camera footage we do critical incident videos for clients where even though you have a forty five

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

day window

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

to put it out there that i mean one of the incidents that i

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[scott]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

was working here in sanburnadino

[shaun]:

ah

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

as soon as we the incident had happened over a weekend chief had called me and we were there filming and

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

editing and got a video out the next day because

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

we could not afford to

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

the circumstances

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

and the information

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

that was being put out there

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

by the individuals

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

involved

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

we couldn't wait the forty five day window the city would have we would have waited the city would have burned down probably

[chris_sherwin]:

okay

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

right

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

it

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

man

[shaun]:

you're talking billions of dollars that you

[scott]:

no

[shaun]:

just saved you know it's just

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

like

[tamrin_olden]:

yeah

[shaun]:

we do we don't know what you do for us by preventing it because i was going

[scott]:

yea

[shaun]:

to ask you how do you measure success with that

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

how would the person your closed like on the ground like how do you measure success like people on understand that of the thousands upon thousands of interactions with people that the cops have every

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

day

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

ninety

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

nine percent of them go like completely cool like not a problem you get tired of watching boring interactions of

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[shaun]:

cops on body cameras so we're like how do people not know that because we let the message not get out there how do you your success on your side

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

at that level like what

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

do you look for

[tamrin_olden]:

it's really it is hard and it's hard

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

because you know on the swan side

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

you go out you make an arrest you book

[scott]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

someone someone gets you know charges filed you rescue someone there's actual tangible thing that shows okay mission accomplished right

[shaun]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

and on the community relations p

[scott]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

r side of it it's hard because you don't know what you truly prevented and i think

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

that the measure the measurement of success is going to be a couple of things that's going to be your community support so seeing the feedback that your community gives you on social media when your community rallies around me when

[shaun]:

eh

[tamrin_olden]:

something does happen that might be controversial

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

or

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

might look negative that they're

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

going to jump in and defend you because they know hey you know what they're transparent they invest in their community

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

i know them better

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

than this and they're jump in and they're going to defend you against

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

navesaers that might come in from the outside

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

so i think the community support is one aspect of it

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

too is going to be internal and we all

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

know that the climate and then the dynamics inside agencies there's a lot of moral issues

[shaun]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

and people not

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

feeling sported

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

even inside they're getting pressure from the outside they're getting pressure

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

from the inside and that's a struggle

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and for me you know

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

the biggest success for

[scott]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

me that i've seen locally and experience well the recent incident is there was the police association

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and some of the officers

[shaun]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

that reached out to me on social media and said hey you have no idea how much that did for us that we feel supported

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

that

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

we had someone helping defend us partnering with the chief

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

to defend us and someone to advocate for us and you know that when you're being beat down and you're in a busy city and you could barely manage your

[scott]:

my

[tamrin_olden]:

case slow the sport detectives

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

in some of these cities i mean they literally cannot manage their sleep deprived they're feeling worn out and just being beaten down and they feel like man it was like a you know we

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

our city potentially could have burned down um

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

and it didn't because we were able to be effective

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

with our

[scott]:

m oh

[tamrin_olden]:

communications so both the

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

public

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and then also inside

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

i think that that's that it's huge

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and then if you're able to get the media

[shaun]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

on your side to be able to

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

even though that's not the main goal decater to the media to

[chris_sherwin]:

my

[tamrin_olden]:

get their support to share a positive story that's huge

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

one

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

of the local media published an article i think it was

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

yesterday that i posted about we've been going back and forth on this case trying to correct misinformation

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

and they did an independent investigation and did public records a request and did their due diligence as a journalist

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

which is great because that's not always the case

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

and really

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

just supported the narrative that we've been pushing so hard to put out because

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

you could sit here and say no this is our evidence this is what happened but when it comes from an outside source it says no we did our home work and there spot on and they're correct

[scott]:

right

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and what people

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

are saying is wrong and having that trifecta

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

of all through those entities

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

ommunity

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

inside the department and the media

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

all lined up to me that's a win

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

at

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

the end of the day when officers can go home and feel

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

supported

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and feel

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

help

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

alleviate

[scott]:

a

[tamrin_olden]:

some of that burn out

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

and moral issues that they're feeling that that's a win for me

[scott]:

well

[chris_sherwin]:

do

[scott]:

it doesn't

[chris_sherwin]:

you

[scott]:

it

[shaun]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

force

[scott]:

help to

[chris_sherwin]:

it

[scott]:

with the media that i mean the sorry

[chris_sherwin]:

o god

[scott]:

doesn't it help to i just want to ask that media thing like i know that maybe we're gettin a little away from this nowadays but a lot of times you would have some of the same local

[shaun]:

yeah

[scott]:

news people that would come out to these

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[scott]:

things

[shaun]:

ah

[scott]:

and i always noticed and i was not a supervisor anything at the time but i was noticed that the supervisors that didn't just try to stone wall those the media people again we

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[scott]:

don't cater just to them but

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[scott]:

if you at least had a brief conversation with them and said yeah yeah you know

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[scott]:

this is what we've got going on but we are going to be getting something out that probably helps that mission to right like they're not going to put bad stuff out

[shaun]:

m

[scott]:

as long as you're being open and saying hey yeah we're going to get something to

[shaun]:

ah

[scott]:

you as soon as we can just you know give us a little bit of time get this thing under control

[tamrin_olden]:

absolutely and at the end of the day

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

you know they have a job to do we have a job to do

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

think how bosses

[shaun]:

ye

[tamrin_olden]:

they answer to

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and they have questions they have to ask and they have stories that they have to cover

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

but like you said if you at least say hey

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

there's reasons why we can't release a ton

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

right now but as soon as we can and things are

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

safe and things are resolved on a ed and we're to a point where we feel comfortable

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

and

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

safe doing that we will

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

absolutely reach two media relations is huge because the media is

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

you know

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

whether we like it or not they're around and

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

trust me i know the

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

names of the people who i could call on

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

if they have they've had

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

information hey i know that

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

the agency is not identifying the officer but i know who it is because you know the fair

[scott]:

right

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

called and i'll

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

go

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

can you please not but

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

as soon as we are ready to release

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

i'll call

[scott]:

right

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

you first because

[scott]:

sure

[tamrin_olden]:

you solid and let you get the lead on that case because

[scott]:

ah

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

it's that mutual respect and

[scott]:

sure

[tamrin_olden]:

helping each other out in their missions and that's that's it big deal i brought in a media panel

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

at my department to meet the local media to kind of break down those barriers

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

of that

[scott]:

ah

[shaun]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

ernest

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

or hay

[shaun]:

yes

[tamrin_olden]:

so that way when

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

they do show up

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

to the scene it's oh that

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

sergeant son so i recognize

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

how you doing and

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

build those relationships because you're going to have to work together whether you like it

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

or not and

[shaun]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

the

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

more you guys can understand

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

each other's roles and expectations

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

the better it's going to

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

be

[scott]:

ye

[tamrin_olden]:

for everybody

[shaun]:

and

[chris_sherwin]:

do you

[shaun]:

you know

[chris_sherwin]:

think

[shaun]:

it's twofold chris sorry

[chris_sherwin]:

do you think from that statement do you think the future or what do you

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

think the future looks like for you do you think at any point in time they're going to be like a fox or c n n or whomever go hey you know what we're just going to plug the tamer's um website and everything else because she has the latest and greatest without spilling anything or would that be your hope that you know you guys

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

have the most current truthful on going active news that that would be just like

[shaun]:

ah

[chris_sherwin]:

hey we're going to filter in right over here to tammron's website or

[shaun]:

ah

[chris_sherwin]:

social median stuff and we're goin to get like right now

[shaun]:

ah

[chris_sherwin]:

without putting a spin on it is that your hope or do you think that will happen

[tamrin_olden]:

you know i am i do like

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

the concept

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

of having

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

an organization that people can go to to get the truth but people's day to day have it in these communities is to gravitate toward their local contact their local department so my goal in my mission and working with my clients

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

is i want to help you guys were in your organization

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

tell your own story

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

vostare good community relations in your local

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

community and by helping

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

you get your message out there so i'm kind of more the

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

behind the scenes

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

how do i help you with

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

a strategy how do i helped create the video

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

write your script

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

deal with the media

[chris_sherwin]:

okay

[tamrin_olden]:

prep your press

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

conference to get you out there in a positive light

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

because

[chris_sherwin]:

okay

[tamrin_olden]:

the last

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

thing you want when someone goes and search is an incident or an organization

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

h

[tamrin_olden]:

a bunch of crap to come up that's you know negative or

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

incorrect or nothing at all

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

so

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

my gal's more to help them um

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

m be out there in a more positive

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

light and providing

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

them the support and the tools and the resources to do

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

so because a lot of agencies

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

don't have a full

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

time staff of photographer you know videographer social media

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

man your pio

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

it's

[shaun]:

oh

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

one person usually doing all

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

that on an ancillary basis

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

so i'd rather

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

help

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

them

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

as a department than have it filter through me but i

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

just

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

because people are

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

going to continue to go to where they're used to that's just people's know their habits but i

[chris_sherwin]:

okay

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

do like the fact that the local media especially

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

a lot of my clients in the air they do know me

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

they will

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

reach out to me they'll ask me questions they'll come to me and i'll be able to say

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

hey don't worry about it we're on it the chief is going to have a statement out soon and because they know they can expect that what we're going to put out is going to be correct it's

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

going to be timely and it's going to be transparent

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

okay

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

terran for

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

our listeners

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

within our work like where the

[chris_sherwin]:

uh

[shaun]:

three cops here

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

you know we can

[chris_sherwin]:

uh

[shaun]:

point to things whether it's internally or externally that we look at and say hey that's how you

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[shaun]:

want to do business like that's something we can take pride in for both us as a profession and the people

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

we serve and there's good and bad examples

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

of all both we also had ones like you know what hapned with

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

george floyd the vast majority cops like now that's not how you do business and majority of us felt that way but

[scott]:

no

[shaun]:

that message didn't get out necessarily in your business people that do what you do across the country i'm sure these cases like when you get a conference in they say this is a bad comparison

[scott]:

a

[shaun]:

and this good comparison can you think of something of the top

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

of your head or just it's well known maybe that you would say this was a good example that most of our listeners could point though and say oh yeah i remember that and it was good or i remember that and this is why it was bad an can you maybe speak to that a little bit

[tamrin_olden]:

i would say on one that was bad and you know you guys mentioned it earlier and you know in reading the um

[shaun]:

a

[tamrin_olden]:

no

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

the study

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

or the report that was released on yiuvaldi i mean there is a handful of pages just dedicated to the failure and communications and

[shaun]:

h

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

that's actually

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

my conference

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

that's coming up is going to be one of the topics that go ver is deep reefing

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

that what went wrong and why

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

not having the right people that are properly

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

trained and the poor

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

communication flow really you know added salt to a wound you

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

are

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

already dealing with a huge tragedy and then you're going you're putting out misinformation and now the families and the victims and the officers and everybody involved having to now deal with you know

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

continuing to pour assaults on that wound and it was just sad it was

[shaun]:

yea

[tamrin_olden]:

really sad that something as simple

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

as having your communications properly in place ferguson was another example of that their first press conference and the the notes that they gave the individual that gave the brief thing i mean it was a joke it really

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

was

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and they learned a

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

hard way i was still

[shaun]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

agencies don't

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

wait

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

like you guys said earlier don't

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

have a plan

[shaun]:

yeah

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

don't

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

learn the hard way i would say that one that i saw that i felt went well um was

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

the december second terris attack and sanburnagino um here that was huge

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

international news

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

and

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

i mean

[chris_sherwin]:

the

[tamrin_olden]:

it was big and it was hard for me because

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

there were people that i knew from my

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[scott]:

a

[tamrin_olden]:

department that were out there and i'm sitting here

[shaun]:

my

[tamrin_olden]:

listening to everything go down and then trying to okay focus comparetmentalize

[scott]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

and

[shaun]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

you know

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

focus on what's going on and how you could help or what information

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

my

[tamrin_olden]:

needs to go out there and listening and mooring

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

because on incidents like that anything big i would sit there and go okay

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

if i were the po

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

there what

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

would i be doing because it's good to

[shaun]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

rehearse that and to see you know what people are doing well

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

and not

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and i would say that their response you know

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

when it all went down it was chaos and unfortunately

[shaun]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

the supervisor

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

was just filling in because the normal pio was

[chris_sherwin]:

yah

[tamrin_olden]:

off on mike she said he i'll take

[chris_sherwin]:

h

[tamrin_olden]:

your i'll take

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

your own call cover pio and

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

then you literally have i

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

insane terris attack happened

[scott]:

right

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

and you're

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

like i was not trained for this

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

knowing to bring in

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

mutual aid and to coordinate the flow of inform then to correct misinformation to provide regular updates i mean you're talking about unified command when it came to the communication side of it putting out regular updates i mean they did a phenomenal

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

job

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

they really did and

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

i actually

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

brought in

[shaun]:

m

[scott]:

no

[tamrin_olden]:

the supervisor

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

that

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

worked that case that was

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

there

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

acting

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

pio sergeant and

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

we did a de brief with our supervisors and

[shaun]:

yah

[tamrin_olden]:

she just reiterated you guys have

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

to be prepared and you have to know

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

who partners are because if something big happens most

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

agencies can't manage it

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

on

[shaun]:

yah

[tamrin_olden]:

their own

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

you're goin to

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

have to call mutual

[shaun]:

yah

[tamrin_olden]:

aid you're going to have to ask the shares

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

department to come in

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

you're going to have to have a whole

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

team of people dealing with social media

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

updates website update

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

yeh

[tamrin_olden]:

social listening the press on scene responding to phone calls

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

i mean it's huge

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and they did an outstanding

[scott]:

ye

[tamrin_olden]:

job at

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

realizing the gravity of the situation reaching out for help and everybody coming in in the region to help so

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

i'll remember

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

it was

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

years ago and that always stood out

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

to me

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

and come

[chris_sherwin]:

and

[shaun]:

to

[chris_sherwin]:

just

[shaun]:

think of it when

[chris_sherwin]:

a

[shaun]:

you talk about that you can remember that and go yeah

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

there wasn't a lot

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

of misinformation that could have ben there because it cold have been very culturally sensitive it could have been very like targeting and

[scott]:

i

[shaun]:

all these other things and it was brutal un fight that ended in that for the police officers and things like that

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

and at the end of that you weren't left feeling

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

like there's something missing here what happened ou know everybody always ask questions but that one was really really great for pointing that out i

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

appreciate it oh

[chris_sherwin]:

and then tar you're talking about your

[scott]:

uh

[chris_sherwin]:

october twenty fourth twenty sixth seminar

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

s in coronado

[chris_sherwin]:

okay give a quick

[scott]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

plug on that because by the way i'm goin to email you later

[shaun]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

because i think i might go to it and i'm just gonna i got some questions on it and stuff like that so

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

but give it a quick plug

[scott]:

i

[chris_sherwin]:

so anybody

[shaun]:

ah

[chris_sherwin]:

who's listening if they have a p i o

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

might be a good idea

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

so just slip it in her real quick

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

yeah absolutely so october

[shaun]:

ye

[tamrin_olden]:

twenty four twenty fifth twenty six it's in coronado

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

so amazing location you

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

have a view of the water the entire conference

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and we're going to be covering everything

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

from incident

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

de brief like uvalde

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

getting the media even to come in and provide their sect perspective

[shaun]:

yeah

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

how to properly

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

manage social media put together and effective positive campaign

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

instead of just always the negative stuff how to build up your platforms

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

the legal side of it so that way you don't

[scott]:

ye

[tamrin_olden]:

get yourself

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

your department

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

in trouble so all aspects

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

of

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

communications

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

whether it's positive stories or critical incident on the digital spectrum and then also dealing with media

[shaun]:

yeah

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

it it's just it's a great event we did our first one last year this year is going to be even bigger and again

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

really inopeade unity to get proper training and a network with other people because it's a small

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

group of people who do this

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

it's not

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

a position that's a priority for a lot of departments unfortunately

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

but it is growing and

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

people are realizing more

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and more the need for it so

[scott]:

my

[tamrin_olden]:

you know obviously great opportunity to

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

get proper training and to now work with people in the industry

[chris_sherwin]:

awesome okay

[scott]:

i got a quick

[chris_sherwin]:

cool

[scott]:

question so you were no reference

[shaun]:

yes

[scott]:

you

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[scott]:

actually mentioned

[shaun]:

yeah

[scott]:

it about those positive messages

[shaun]:

i

[scott]:

because yeah unfortunately with a lot of these things were always

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[scott]:

talking about critical incidents

[shaun]:

oh

[scott]:

or you know bad things and we talked on here before about

[shaun]:

yeah

[scott]:

with other

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[scott]:

guests about social media and getting those positive messages out

[shaun]:

yah

[scott]:

about the things

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[scott]:

that police departments are

[shaun]:

h

[scott]:

doing is there like one piece of advice or suggestion

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[scott]:

or kind of a two part question that like what to do better and do you

[shaun]:

yeah

[scott]:

think that police departments are getting

[shaun]:

ah

[scott]:

better with their social

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[scott]:

media about getting those positive stories out because like you said if you if you engaged with your community and they think that you're open and they

[chris_sherwin]:

ye

[scott]:

hear

[shaun]:

ye

[scott]:

the good things that you're doing then when there's a critical incident you have that trust where they say well i'm going to wait and get all the details

[shaun]:

oh

[scott]:

of this you know before i make it cision on it because i feel like this is a good open and

[shaun]:

m

[scott]:

honest police department

[tamrin_olden]:

you know i do think that people are doing a better job

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

as they're dedicating

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

more resources and picking

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

the right people i mean i do classes and we do introductions

[scott]:

m

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

then people like oh i was

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

was told to be here or you can tell that they're as

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

it

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

about

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[scott]:

yeah they're not in it yet

[tamrin_olden]:

yeah they

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

were either the

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

closest proximity to the chief when you needed to decide somebody was doing

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

it or they're like oh

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

you're young you know social media

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

here you go

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

and they don't

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

really want

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

to do it so i think

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

that picking

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

people who are

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

right fit who could be the face of your organization who understand the concept of putting you out there in a positive light and are willing put themselves out there in a positive light um that's that's going to be the first thing and i do think that people

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

are understanding you have agencies over here a lot of departments have community

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

relations teams now we're sworn and civilian where their main

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

focus is

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

to go out there and address quality

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

of life issues to go out there and do positive stuff in the community

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

to do outreach to

[chris_sherwin]:

yea

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

do pio and so media

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

where they actually have

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

dedicated resources so we are definitely making

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

progress the other side of it is training your brain to look for those opportunities because you know as officers as law enforcement it's another day to maybe you show up and you're helping your first on scene to a car fire and you're pulling people out while a car is burning or you're

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

talking someone off the ledge

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

or you're giving p r to a baby

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

or you go and you solve the case and find

[shaun]:

ah oh

[tamrin_olden]:

someone who was kidnapped

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

and

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

you go home and you clock out and just another day right

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

yep

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

you're also not thinking of it like oh

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

we need to put this out on the news and social media because that's not what

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

it's about but when you

[scott]:

all right

[tamrin_olden]:

have to like people and you're

[scott]:

yah

[tamrin_olden]:

sitting there i would read the

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

logs

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

i would sit in briefing

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

or i would

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

hear about

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

them talking

[shaun]:

yeh

[tamrin_olden]:

about something in

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

a go i'm going to pull the body warn camera footage on that or that's an amazing story or

[shaun]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

you know

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

what about we interview the family of the person that you saved and

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

how it impact

[shaun]:

yeah

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

them and

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

look

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

for

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

its opportunities to show the day to

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

day stuff because it does allow them to rally around you and support you it also does a lot in

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

educating people on what the job entails

[chris_sherwin]:

eh

[tamrin_olden]:

because people are very

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

miss led they don't understand

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

the day to day tragedies the things you're exposed to

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

the stress they don't see that stuff so i think it's so important to get people kind of a

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

peak behind the scenes what

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

in the life is and

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

taking those moments

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

i actually had um a chief here locally and props to them bell gardens

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[scott]:

i

[tamrin_olden]:

the chief reached out and said hey we have body worn cameras

[scott]:

i

[tamrin_olden]:

i know

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

it's only a matter of time before we're going to have some sort of a critical incident officer involved shooting we're going to have to put out there i don't want our community's

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

first exposure to us putting information out

[chris_sherwin]:

ah

[tamrin_olden]:

in that for mat to be an officer in love shooting where who knows how that's going to go down or what the circumstances

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

are

[shaun]:

right

[scott]:

right

[shaun]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

so he sought out he said we had a great incident

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

someone was threatening to shoot us themselves

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

they ran from us and our officers took time to show compassion to descalate

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

you know to apply that training because desolation

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

training is huge and

[scott]:

hm

[tamrin_olden]:

to literally talk someone off of the ledge and get them help and show

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

compassion

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

he goes

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

we need to put that out there

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

show that not every interaction like you guys said the majority of interactions are going to end well that officers

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

you know doing the right

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

thing

[scott]:

okay

[tamrin_olden]:

and that you know everyone goes home and we

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

need to do a better job at showing

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

that and so i thought that was really cool for the chief to go no we need to put

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

this out there to the officers it was another day but we need to

[scott]:

right

[tamrin_olden]:

let the unity know

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

hey

[scott]:

pro active good yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

exactly and yeah this person could have

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

been

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

available threat was making threats to shoot us

[scott]:

hm

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

shoot himself and it could have gone a lot differently but because of how they

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

reacted didn't and

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

i think that we need to be better of looking at those opportunities as pio social media managers and even as advent

[scott]:

yah

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

and helping shed our personal and a positive light on a regular sis

[chris_sherwin]:

that's awesome

[scott]:

absolutely

[chris_sherwin]:

that's

[shaun]:

well it's

[chris_sherwin]:

awesome

[shaun]:

evident that you embrace

[chris_sherwin]:

my

[shaun]:

the amendment

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

to the constitution like anybody else but most importantly

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

the first because the free and open press is part of the first amendment

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

and we do a great representation

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

of

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

trying to explain to people what the fourth amendment

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

s about which is largely where the police operate the

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

fourth and the fifth and bringing those two together

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

is huge i mean we can't keep forsaking the media i mean we grew up

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

in an era the three of us where you did you first took them and you didn't want them and we didn't recognize that media

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

is changing there just like we like citizen soldiers there are now citizen journalists that are running around out there with cameras

[chris_sherwin]:

hm

[shaun]:

and microphones that you can easily buy just

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

like we're doing here so

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

can't thank you now for that i'm gonna tell you right now just to kind of end on where we started i want to do a

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

huge press relief on when i find technical pants that don't make me look high wasted

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

in the police world i'm gonna

[tamrin_olden]:

a

[shaun]:

m going to grab you get you for that

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

i

[shaun]:

okay

[tamrin_olden]:

love that

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

you said that because there's a

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

real lot

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

i haven't said i i ve said any bad words

[scott]:

yeah yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

but i used

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

to say these

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

are the worst

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

cut pants ever like

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

highway stand

[shaun]:

right

[scott]:

right

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

i used to say

[shaun]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

some one design some pans that don't make

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

everybody look like the horse ass because

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

i

[chris_sherwin]:

yah

[tamrin_olden]:

so i'm like we should technical yoga pat

[scott]:

right

[chris_sherwin]:

h

[tamrin_olden]:

set of things

[shaun]:

right

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

oh my

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

god oh my god

[tamrin_olden]:

i need to

[scott]:

right right

[chris_sherwin]:

i don't

[scott]:

five

[chris_sherwin]:

want to see shan

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

technical

[scott]:

five

[chris_sherwin]:

yoga

[scott]:

eleven

[chris_sherwin]:

pants

[tamrin_olden]:

rod

[shaun]:

oh my god

[tamrin_olden]:

you

[shaun]:

my

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

god

[chris_sherwin]:

no

[shaun]:

it's like that's come on

[scott]:

i'll be in short soon enough

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

really

[shaun]:

yeah

[scott]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

fat your legs

[shaun]:

yeah yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

long

[chris_sherwin]:

uh

[tamrin_olden]:

so if anybody

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

wants

[scott]:

h

[tamrin_olden]:

five eleven

[scott]:

h

[tamrin_olden]:

do you want to do a technical yoga pants line in

[shaun]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

i'll be there

[scott]:

h

[tamrin_olden]:

for

[scott]:

i'm

[tamrin_olden]:

it

[scott]:

in

[shaun]:

big

[chris_sherwin]:

i'm

[shaun]:

fan

[chris_sherwin]:

an

[shaun]:

of the kilt myself so it's all good

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

that's

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

a tactical kilt

[shaun]:

well

[tamrin_olden]:

yeah

[shaun]:

thanks so that was great stuff i really appreciate

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

it you know maybe moving forward we can have you

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

come back and talk to us about incidents

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

that are

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

going

[scott]:

for sure

[shaun]:

on and we can do these quick drops with you hey you're good with a fifteen minute one and

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[shaun]:

we can drop in because you do a great job with this i mean it was really it's like

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

it doesn't make me hate the media as much as i used to i gonna be honest with it's a necessary evil and the way

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

you explain it to us and hopefully our listener you understand that these these these amendments that we all live safely

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

under and are formed by or protected by have to live in conjunction with each other now at the expense

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

of each other and i think a lot of our leaders are not recognizing that and you're doing a great job particularly for such a young lady just recently out of high school like i

[tamrin_olden]:

oh

[shaun]:

mean you had to

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

be student council president or something like that

[tamrin_olden]:

yes

[shaun]:

to educate us

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[shaun]:

on something that's great

[chris_sherwin]:

right

[shaun]:

you're doing

[scott]:

yeah

[shaun]:

a great job and i can't thank you oh thank you

[tamrin_olden]:

thank

[chris_sherwin]:

thank

[tamrin_olden]:

you

[chris_sherwin]:

you so

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

much

[scott]:

it was

[chris_sherwin]:

cameron

[scott]:

great thank you

[chris_sherwin]:

really appreciate it

[tamrin_olden]:

i really appreciate your time and investing in supporting you know

[shaun]:

eh

[tamrin_olden]:

what i'm

[chris_sherwin]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

trying to do and you helping our departments being seen out there in a better light so you

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

so much

[chris_sherwin]:

my

[shaun]:

bet

[chris_sherwin]:

pleasure and then taman real quick where could everybody find you in social media

[scott]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

internet

[shaun]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

wherever

[shaun]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

so you could follow me at cameron olden

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

across all platforms t

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

m r n o l d

[shaun]:

oh

[tamrin_olden]:

n and our website where you could see everything

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

that we do

[shaun]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

we do photography

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

vide ography

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

um

[chris_sherwin]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

recruitment videos websites communications

[scott]:

yeah

[tamrin_olden]:

training all of that is talk public relations dot com to

[scott]:

m

[tamrin_olden]:

c public relations dot com

[chris_sherwin]:

thank you so much and for everybody out there please take

[scott]:

oh

[shaun]:

yeah

[chris_sherwin]:

the time to go where you get your podcast

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

download

[shaun]:

m

[chris_sherwin]:

subscribe leave writing a review we're really trying to get the truth out there to mend the relationship between civilians

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

and police because

[shaun]:

yah

[chris_sherwin]:

it is a

[scott]:

oh

[chris_sherwin]:

super important because we

[shaun]:

yah

[chris_sherwin]:

all need to work together to make this roll the better place thank you everybody have an awesome

[scott]:

a

[chris_sherwin]:

day

[shaun]:

my bit

[chris_sherwin]:

it

[scott]:

but

[chris_sherwin]:

yeah

[shaun]:

yeah